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  #51  
Old 08-06-2022, 09:13 PM
crystallographic crystallographic is offline
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Originally Posted by foamcar View Post
Made a longer template to check overall conture. Pretty good fit. One last small ridge circled in red. Kent why a covex dolly on a concave surface when heat shrinking? Seems concave would help it match contour.
Attachment 64192

Attachment 64193
Good work.
The concave this body presents at this location is curved two ways, short curve and long.
Your convex dolly fits the long curve and when the spots in the valley are heated and then smacked, the dolly supports well in long direction while the metal itself supports / resists expansion in the cross-wise direction.
Experience reveals that this contour and its damage can benefit from brief effective techniques + simple tools.

However, this all goes sideways when the metal has had heavy grinding (9in. sidewinder w/24grit open coat, for example ..... ... and is too thin overall, or too thin in random areas.)
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Last edited by crystallographic; 08-06-2022 at 09:16 PM.
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  #52  
Old 08-08-2022, 06:55 PM
foamcar foamcar is offline
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Thanks Kent.
Sorry to disappoint but I have given up on trying to smooth this section out. Beyond my skill level. I tried to shrink that last ridge and tore the metal. I cut out the bad section and now my long template fits very well. I used other techniques I have learned on this forum to shape a patch piece. Almost there.20220808_165814.jpg

20220808_163531.jpg

20220808_163522.jpg

With that large opening I was able to smooth out adjacent metal with dolly and slapper.
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  #53  
Old 08-08-2022, 07:10 PM
crystallographic crystallographic is offline
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Thanks Kent.
Sorry to disappoint but I have given up on trying to smooth this section out. Beyond my skill level. I tried to shrink that last ridge and tore the metal. I cut out the bad section and now my long template fits very well. I used other techniques I have learned on this forum to shape a patch piece. Almost there.Attachment 64212

Attachment 64213

Attachment 64214

With that large opening I was able to smooth out adjacent metal with dolly and slapper.
All for the best, Phil.
Don't worry - the metal had been way overworked before it came to you.
You are on to smoother metal now.
Yeehaw.
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  #54  
Old 08-09-2022, 01:46 AM
Jaroslav Jaroslav is online now
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Big congrats Phil. I was waiting for the hole to be cut. And it happened. Good work.
I guess it had to be that way. Be careful with welding. But that should be fine. You have released the tension in the body. It will be good now.
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  #55  
Old 08-09-2022, 07:53 AM
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I find that in situations like this, as my experience grows, making the decision to cut sooner rather than later is the trend. When something quacks and waddles by, I call it a duck rather than assume its a pigeon in disguise now. Because if a guy stops to plan the more certain cut repair and compares it to that which is required to make the more heroic but less certain (to himself) uncut repair, often it can be true that the cut way is best within his skill set. Spot that earlier on and get ahead. Patching, and using a reasonable amount of body filler, are not sins. I am glad to see you get past the problem spot. I have yet to meet a customer who wishes to buy filler-free automotive steel work.
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  #56  
Old 08-10-2022, 08:02 PM
crystallographic crystallographic is offline
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Hindsight is helpfully accurate in analyzing why, how long, and whether or not ....

In situations like these, the careful repair technique can save hours of cutting in a patch down in a reverse.

I do note:
Specifically in this case, the metal had been sharply folded during previous repairs ... and likely hammered as well, creating fatigue-failure at the fold line - which split with just a little more hammering.

Skilled eyes with a bright light would probably have detected this ...
and the solution I have used many times would have been to heat the fold area to dull red and then open the fold ... Then re-heat the area and smooth down. IF the metal however, begins to separate during smoothing - it is not any big deal to stop hammering, weld that, and then smooth it, using the residual weld heat.

It is always fine to cut and weld in patches throughout the steel autobody repair process.
However, with the bit of steel autobody wreck/repair experience backing up the recommendation here, in this particular case, an hour of hand work was not a complete waste of time.

Here is a bit of an example to support my thinking:
Wrecked old steel car.
With samples of previous "Wonder Butter" applications, over fiberglas, and with old body solder repairs along with ... (note light gray color, RH side).
The lip of the nose opening had been hit many times (no Real bumper on this model, only "ettes") and had been straightened and welded, and straightened and brazed and body soldered.
And straightened and fiberglassed ... and ... hit and spackled. ..

Ferrari 300 America.jpg

Ferrari 300 America, final copy.jpg
You can see the weld line around the nose opening, where the whole new oval nose opening section was welded in and planished out.
A combination of working out the wrinkles while shoving out/up/down the impact zone - along with shaping up a new strong opening section... Then fitting, trimming and torching that in place, once the geometry was back, and enough support was created to hold the shape for the the new section - keeping the grille-fit as confirmation of shape and appearance.

Phil has done a very good job on his 356 body resto thus far .... and only hit his snag in perhaps the most troublesome spot on a 356.
...Sigh....

Like Jim Taylor used to say to me,
"I'm all done with the job, Stretch - 'cept for finishin' up."
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Last edited by crystallographic; 08-10-2022 at 08:04 PM.
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  #57  
Old 08-11-2022, 01:09 AM
Jaroslav Jaroslav is online now
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Nice work Kent and I agree with your analysis of the problem.
Phil, good progress.

As we say "we should have done this shot right from on the start".... or when we are screwing in the last screw "we should have put it in there right away"...
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  #58  
Old 08-12-2022, 03:59 PM
foamcar foamcar is offline
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Thanks for the words of encouragement. Yes, that metal repair was beyond my skill set. I did shrink a few other spots once I got comfortable wirh the process so not all lost. The patch is almost ready to weld in. I made metal templates in both directions and tacked them on the patch to help hold shape and locate as I tack in. It almost drops in flush all around. Just a little more tweakng.

20220812_160419.jpg

20220812_160339.jpg
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  #59  
Old 08-13-2022, 06:34 PM
crystallographic crystallographic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foamcar View Post
Thanks for the words of encouragement. Yes, that metal repair was beyond my skill set. I did shrink a few other spots once I got comfortable wirh the process so not all lost. The patch is almost ready to weld in. I made metal templates in both directions and tacked them on the patch to help hold shape and locate as I tack in. It almost drops in flush all around. Just a little more tweakng.

Attachment 64252

Attachment 64253
Phil,
That is a very secure way to lock the contour for welding into the reverse.
Both the belt and the suspenders.
Gold Star!
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  #60  
Old 08-17-2022, 03:10 PM
foamcar foamcar is offline
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Patch tacked in. Able to planish some before grinding down. Need to get my comma dolly on a longer stick to reach way up there.

20220817_154503.jpg
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