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  #21  
Old 02-04-2015, 08:23 PM
crystallographic crystallographic is offline
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Well, I think we are all in agreement, then?
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  #22  
Old 02-04-2015, 08:28 PM
Marc Bourget Marc Bourget is offline
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Unless you have one of these in your shop!
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  #23  
Old 02-05-2015, 07:17 AM
AllyBill AllyBill is offline
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As a metal shaper of over thirty years experience and having worked in automotive to offshore with everything in between I think I would be a bit put off if I came in here as a newbie wanting to make a simple fuel tank for my Seagull outboard and got bombarded with a metallurgy lesson.

So back to basics. Get some aluminium, any grade will do, make it into the fuel tank you want and weld or braze as suits any other grade of aluminium to it until it looks right and doesn't leak then bolt it to your boat and off you go. Don't forget the fire extinguisher but then you should never leave shore without it anyway. That's all you need to know and if you get stuck on the basics just ask.
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  #24  
Old 02-05-2015, 10:16 AM
crystallographic crystallographic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Bourget View Post


Unless you have one of these in your shop!
MArc,
That is a very nice oven for heat treating.
You could do some aluminum parts in there, but rack them so they don't go out of shape when you pick them up and toss them in the quench. Aluminum at 925F has all the strength of wet kleenex. (Bottom-drop ovens are the ones preferred by aluminum heat tresters.)

I'll bet there are some here who would like to hear of your oven's help on some shaping jobs. Annealing, brazing, treating frameworks, hardening forming dies ... ??
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  #25  
Old 02-05-2015, 12:51 PM
weldtoride weldtoride is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllyBill View Post
...... I would be a bit put off if I came in here as a newbie ...... and got bombarded with a metallurgy lesson.
I beg to differ. While not new to welding by any measure, I have done very limited Al welding, O/A and TIG so far, but I anticipate more in my future, so I appreciate everyone's metallurgy information, especially regards Al.

Everyone, please don't hesitate to put up tech info, however esoteric. Let the reader decide when its TMI.

It is sometimes quipped that "knowledge is dangerous", but lack of knowledge is far more dangerous.
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  #26  
Old 02-05-2015, 04:20 PM
elavir elavir is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weldtoride View Post
I beg to differ. While not new to welding by any measure, I have done very limited Al welding, O/A and TIG so far, but I anticipate more in my future, so I appreciate everyone's metallurgy information, especially regards Al.

Everyone, please don't hesitate to put up tech info, however esoteric. Let the reader decide when its TMI.

It is sometimes quipped that "knowledge is dangerous", but lack of knowledge is far more dangerous.
I agree with Mark, especially because I'm new here I want to get as much information as I can, so keep up the good work.
As for the tank, I think I try to make two. One welded and one brazed. It might take a while because it's all new to me but when succeed I post some pictures.
I spoke to a salasman in the stainless steel factory in the neighbourhood who could deliver 1050 plate but wasn't sure they had 6061 tubing, 6060 they had. Can this be gaswelded?

Richard.
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  #27  
Old 02-05-2015, 04:38 PM
Doug M Doug M is offline
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I agree with Mark also.The first time you hear something WAY over your knowledge base you may only get some idea there is more to learn "out there". It may take 6-8 times hearing some part of a subject that you start thinking how the info will help you but you begin to think you could use it. Then after studying it some more AH-HA may really get you another step on your way to better/easier/greater success.

Success beyond what is known today is what we are looking for anyway isn't it?

TMI has many meanings. I cannot understand that information (what ever it is) in the context may mean I don't know enough to use it (yet) given time I'll understand enough to use the info to advantage.
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  #28  
Old 02-05-2015, 05:24 PM
crystallographic crystallographic is offline
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Default Alloy 6060 - 6061 weldability

Quote:
Originally Posted by elavir View Post
I spoke to a salasman in the stainless steel factory in the neighbourhood who could deliver 1050 plate but wasn't sure they had 6061 tubing, 6060 they had. Can this be gaswelded? Richard.
Hi Richard,
Aluminum alloy 6060 is weldable, according to German research,
http://link.springer.com/article/10....3263457#page-2

and the fillers recommended are 4043 (AlSi) and 5356 (AlMg) - (since the alloy is Al-Si-Mg-Cr this makes much sense.) Gas welding would be fine since the Mg levels are below 4.5%.

The melting point of the 6061 -6060 is very low, and is actually right at the melting point of some very good brazing materials - 1040F. Although published information would lead one to beleive that brazing these alloys is not feasible, it is very well done, and is actually accomplished below the solidus of the 6060-6061 parent metal.
(cheering from the crowd)!!!
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  #29  
Old 02-05-2015, 06:47 PM
Marc Bourget Marc Bourget is offline
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From my point of view, social group dynamics are relentless. I feel it would be wise to shed attitudes, open your perspectives and NOT "take it personal"

Many times I reply directly to a post with an answer intended for the group as a whole.

I don't think asking a reasonable question is a personal attack. On the other hand . . .

I've asked "here to learn," AllyBill three times (IIRC) for more detail on his filler rod recommendations. He's come back each time with a vague reference to 2XXX and “diluting up.”

I acknowledge that he has no duty to expend any effort into his replies, but, the repeated response seemed vague, so I did some research and found some local (for him) UK guidelines. His point on "diluting up" with a 2XXX filler returned with 2319, but I also found 5356 filler that is a "commonly recommended practice with several UK aluminum suppliers.

So now I've had the privilege of sharing more accurate info with the group, as a whole.

If you take it personal, you're only cutting off further opportunity to share and learn.

Onward and upward

mjb
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  #30  
Old 02-05-2015, 08:01 PM
AllyBill AllyBill is offline
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Three times? I mustn't have been paying attention. What was it you wanted to know about which filler I choose for any given job?

Will
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