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  #11  
Old 02-06-2018, 04:22 PM
lots2learn lots2learn is offline
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I use my own equipment when I do side work. Have a small shop with welders etc. Reason I don't do more side work is I cant find the time to do my own projects. And I make a lot more per hour from overtime at work. Even though the side work is always more interesting. I operate a mouse at my day job.

Ive never had much luck finding good data on any website. BLS, Glassdoor etc. WELDTORIDE said it best. The only really good source of data will be from local shop owners and employees. Locality makes a huge difference.
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  #12  
Old 02-06-2018, 04:49 PM
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Labor rates National
Name:  Wages Natl.jpg
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Labor Rates Ohio
Name:  Labor Rate Ohio.JPG
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Looks like Autobody Repair Techs (both National and Ohio) are in the $20 to $25 per hour range.

Your results may Vary!
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Last edited by Richard K; 02-06-2018 at 04:52 PM.
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  #13  
Old 02-06-2018, 04:55 PM
cooverwatch cooverwatch is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard K View Post
Greg,

Perhaps a few pertinent questions Greg:

How much did you make in the career work you did?

Would you expect to add a profit and overhead percentage onto employee's wages? You should add 30 to 50% as business owner.

The business owner should be the highest earner in the shop?
thanks for responding Richard.
in my last career I was over 200k total compensation base+Bonus and benefits. As always I would and a percentage to everything that goes through the shop. the question really was if someone was contracting to do a job and they were using the shops equipment and resources would it be normal to charge the same price as if you were doing it with your own equipment.
this brings up a whole other can of worms as then are you really a contractor or an employee.....

we live in a small town so there is not really much to choose from. I don't think he really wants to take the risk of going on his own and doesn't want to drive into "town" for a job.

All in all I need the help right now if I want to make the car shows this summer and flip a few as I am still getting the new shop setup and doing some other cars. the price is what it is for these two cars. just trying to run the numbers on a few things to make sure I don't give him more then what I am paying myself. Can't price the car out of the market so to speak.
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  #14  
Old 02-06-2018, 04:58 PM
cooverwatch cooverwatch is offline
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thanks again Richard, I was just going to look for that info....
sure glad I switched from working on aircraft and went into computer programming. Hot coffee and a warm office every day...
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  #15  
Old 02-06-2018, 05:59 PM
lots2learn lots2learn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard K View Post
Greg,

Perhaps a few pertinent questions Greg:

How much did you make in the career work you did?

Would you expect to add a profit and overhead percentage onto employee's wages? You should add 30 to 50% as business owner.

The business owner should be the highest earner in the shop?
I agree, The owners is taking most of the risk. All liabilities and should make the most profit.
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  #16  
Old 02-07-2018, 05:51 PM
John Buchtenkirch John Buchtenkirch is online now
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Most real good auto body guys in my area take home some cash so you really can’t go by any charts . ~ John Buchtenkirch
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  #17  
Old 02-07-2018, 06:30 PM
Chris_Hamilton Chris_Hamilton is offline
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There is a difference as well in pay between Collision guys and Restoration/Custom guys. Collision guys generally make more than Resto guys. Oddly enough Collision guys could make more 25 years ago than they do today. I made much more in my 20's than I do now. When I was starting out in 1991 it was not unheard of for a good Collision guy working at a commission based Shop to make 100K+ a year. Actually it was pretty common. Guys in parts of Florida and So-Cal would make even more, sometimes a lot more than 100K a year. Some guys made even more than that in the mid to late 80's into the early 90's before the Insurance companies started trimming all the fat. Shop I worked at in Charlotte in the early 90's two guys were making 125K+. Heck even though I was inexperienced I made 60K my second year there. Slowly though Flat Rate Shops have disappeared and now you are lucky to make $22/hr around here. More like 18/hr for most guys. Some of it was the Insurance Companies tightening things up, some of it was the Shop Owners wanting to make even more and pay us less. I always thought Flat Rate was a good deal for both the Tech and the Shop Owner. 40% to the Tech, 60% to the Owner for each billable hour. Both make more the more hours you can turn.
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  #18  
Old 02-08-2018, 08:15 AM
rustreapers rustreapers is offline
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His tools sound very light. The welder is a plus but you can over come that for what 2gs. If he is that seasoned to command that wage he should have about 300 lbs of tools and boxes. That is a wage I would expect having 20 years in restoration, have the portfolio to prove it and my tool boxes weight 300lbs empty.Not allowing for the cost of living form Columbus Ohio to your location.
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Last edited by rustreapers; 02-08-2018 at 08:22 AM. Reason: more to add
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  #19  
Old 02-08-2018, 09:20 AM
cliffrod cliffrod is offline
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If he was good enough to regularly command his desired wage goal at a given shop, he wouldn't have to move from shop to shop.... The shop owner would keep him there if all were making money consistently at that level. Very simple to soak up the limited amount of good work in one place, exhaust the supply and then have to go elsewhere to do it all over again. Average out the in-between $$ droughts into the "good" money and it's probably not big pay income.

I worked federal program employment services years ago, regularly referencing labor wage tables & stats as referenced above as I serviced layoffs for large companies like LockHeed Martin in Oak Ridge TN for numerous technically overqualified but now irrelevant skill sets. The salary data, just like job estimator costing tools with regional adjustments, are relevant as a point of reference but not absolute. As with any quality statistical information, outlier data points are typically discarded so as not to shift the mean, median and mode up or down in a statistically significant manner. So someone building a serious car from scratch for a six figure paycheck is not deemed as equivalent to fender replacement. If there are not enough such specialists, there may not be a section on the table for that specialty. The real specialists defy the data. That's what makes them special.

Since then and after nearly two decades in a specialty field comparable to (actually much less common than) higher end metal work, nearly all of us in the USA are either self-employed in our own studio or contract workers (to avoid the specific obligations & legalities of being "partner") for such a studio owner. whatever the $$ split- 50-50, 60-40, there is no "employment" remaining like there used to be unless you are a min wage helper. Union bill of $20-$24/hr plus all the benefits is not sustainable for my specialty anymore even within the industry, so it's every man and woman for themselves. There's money to be made, but not in a manner conducive to typical business operations.

In the end, he is worth what he gets paid- just like the rest of us. No skin in the game and able to walk at any time (right to work state?) while someone else chases the work and keeps the lights on means less guaranteed compensation. Let him work his way up from $15-$18/hr to his desired $30/hr wage. If you are not going to simply hire him with related significant costs to cover, better to do a minor split with opportunity for a bonus percentage at end if it's there. Keep him obligated to keep him serious and participating in the overall success- not just his. Otherwise let him wreck someone else's program. jmho.
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  #20  
Old 02-08-2018, 09:39 AM
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OK. I was going to stay out of this to see if someone brought up the "friend" factor. No one commented on this so here goes.
Is this gentleman a good friend? If so, is it really a good idea to change that relationship to employee? All kinds of things happen in the course of trying to make a living and some of those things can stress a relationship. He may not be that good of an employee. Can you fire him if he is a "good" friend? What happens if you hit a slow patch? Can you lay him off?
It is not unlike turning a hobby into a business. It takes the fun away for some people. There are side effects to most decisions. Is it worth it to take a chance on losing a friend? Good friends are hard to come by and those relationships need to be protected.
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