All MetalShaping

Go Back   All MetalShaping > Metal Shaping Projects > Automotive Projects
  Today's Posts Posts for Last 7 Days Posts for Last 14 Days  

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #21  
Old 02-08-2018, 01:15 PM
Richard K's Avatar
Richard K Richard K is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Minneapolis, MN or On the Road
Posts: 1,129
Default

Well said, AC

Denver is only about 40 miles from Elizabeth.

If, as you stated the man "doesn't want to drive into town for a job.": I would wonder if his ambitions include your shop's success.
__________________
Richard K

Last edited by Richard K; 02-08-2018 at 01:24 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 02-08-2018, 07:40 PM
cooverwatch cooverwatch is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Elizabeth, Colorado
Posts: 13
Default

well said AC. Thanks to all of you for your thoughts. have given me a lot to think about.

Mr C. - he is more of an acquaintance. Friend of a friend.

Once he is done with the two jobs I have I will sit down and figure out where to go. I do have some work coming in but not enough to keep us both busy. Have him working on two of my cars to get me caught up while I work on another and the two other jobs.

Thank again to everyone. Has changed my perspective a bit then where it was when I posted.
__________________
Greg
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 02-08-2018, 08:31 PM
pplace's Avatar
pplace pplace is offline
MetalShaper of the Month March 2018
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Hector, MN
Posts: 153
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cooverwatch View Post
. Once he is done with the two jobs I have I will sit down and figure out where to go. I do have some work coming in but not enough to keep us both busy. Have him working on two of my cars to get me caught up while I work on another and the two other jobs.

Thank again to everyone. Has changed my perspective a bit then where it was when I posted.
So heís already begun helping you? I took it at the start of this topic that you were tossing the idea around. If heís already begun and you didnít hash out wages prior to that, you could be in a sticky situation.

In my opinion Iíve seen too many guys that sound like this. Usually anybody worth having is tough to get as they are already employed and not hunting or jumping around to different jobs all the time. Also if heís so secure in his skills and ability as well as setting his own wages, he might be best to start his own business and cut out the ďmiddle manĒ and reap all the rewards for himself!ha
__________________
Rush too much trying to get to the end when the end is closer when you take your time.

Dane
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 02-08-2018, 10:37 PM
Andyman Andyman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 30
Default

It sounds like you are hiring a body man not a metalshaper. A skilled guy working in an insurance driven shop is going to make good money. The dollar amount is dependent on where you live. I live in California ,and work as a mechanic, and I wouldn't work for 17-18 an hour. Other parts of the country that my be prevailing wage. I suggest checking with higher end body shops in your area and see what the higher skilled guys get paid. You didn't say if this was under the table or not.

Andy
__________________
Andy Clary
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 02-09-2018, 09:06 AM
cooverwatch cooverwatch is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Elizabeth, Colorado
Posts: 13
Default

to clarify, he is currently working on two of my personal project cars as a contractor (1099) with an agreed upon price. No worries at this time.

As I am a one man shop. I was trying to figure out if I could bring him on at the price he needed.

one of the projects I am getting ready to do will need more metal shaping then he is doing right now. 38 Desoto that needs the trunk completely rebuilt, fender shaped, ect. you all know the drill with these old cars.

there is a few of us in the area that have shops with only the owners working. we occasionally help each other out when the need arises which is nice.

After reading everyone's post and if I was in his position I would build up my equipment and outfit a home shop to augment my income. Have a higher price to do the work out of my shop and then another lower price to work out of someone else's shop using their equipment as a 1099'd worker.

also, the shop owner then would have to make sure his liabilities are covered.

When I started all this I was not looking to really start another business. just play with a few cars, sell them when I was done and then start over again. Need something to do other then fish and golf. :-) I just need some help on occasion in a few area's that my skills are lacking.

Thanks again for everyone's input. it has been an interesting conversation and has changed my thinking from the beginning of this post.
__________________
Greg
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 02-09-2018, 09:03 PM
John Buchtenkirch John Buchtenkirch is offline
MetalShaper of the Month October 2012
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Glen Cove, Long Island
Posts: 1,445
Default

I pretty much agree with Andy in post #24. The fellow in question is likely worth $1200 working as a body man but may not be worth anything near that amount working in restoration and metal shaping. Another question that comes to mind is do you have the equipment necessary to allow him to make that money plus profit for you ? A worker is only expected to own hand tools and maybe a few pneumatic tools, equipment like brakes, bead rollers, an E-wheel, planishing hammer, shears, etc. are really up to the shop owner. Iím not trying to tell you what equipment you need, but itís likely you will need some to be productive enough for people to agree to pay their bills. While restoring a car or two during retirement could be fun I cannot recommend automotive restoration as a retirement business unless you are so wealthy making money isnít a priority . ~ John Buchtenkirch
__________________
John
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 02-10-2018, 06:22 AM
route56wingnut route56wingnut is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: dennison Mn.
Posts: 958
Default

Agree with John unless you have the equipment and talents to understand the speed at which these processes should be accomplished, it sounds like planned failure. The best panel hangers are not well suited to be the best panel bangers. As the old saying goes if you want to make a ton of money in restoration work you better start with 2 tons
__________________
Dan Pate
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 02-11-2018, 01:39 PM
cooverwatch cooverwatch is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Elizabeth, Colorado
Posts: 13
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Buchtenkirch View Post
I pretty much agree with Andy in post #24. The fellow in question is likely worth $1200 working as a body man but may not be worth anything near that amount working in restoration and metal shaping. Another question that comes to mind is do you have the equipment necessary to allow him to make that money plus profit for you ? A worker is only expected to own hand tools and maybe a few pneumatic tools, equipment like brakes, bead rollers, an E-wheel, planishing hammer, shears, etc. are really up to the shop owner. Iím not trying to tell you what equipment you need, but itís likely you will need some to be productive enough for people to agree to pay their bills. While restoring a car or two during retirement could be fun I cannot recommend automotive restoration as a retirement business unless you are so wealthy making money isnít a priority . ~ John Buchtenkirch
But John, the guys on the Internet and TV are making a boat load of cash and doing it all in just a few weeks... and the Internet and TV don't lie.

I am in the process of outfitting the shop with the proper tooling. I have a break, bead roller, shear, and roller. will be ordering an E-Wheel and hammer in the next few months. just have not decided on what to get.
Although making money is always nice, if I can make enough on what I am doing to buy another project when I finish one I will be happy. I have done well over the last few years with various businesses and blessed with the financial planning of great grandparents that my priorities have changed from chasing the almighty dollar to enjoying life and helping others.

I appreciate all the feedback that has been given. It has broaden my thinking on what I would be looking for if I grow to have enough business that warrants hiring additional help. for now, hiring out specific jobs seems the best way to go and adjusting the price based on working in house or off site.
__________________
Greg
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 02-20-2018, 02:13 PM
redoxide redoxide is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: North East Scotland
Posts: 477
Default

its a funny thing that computer programmers earn so much money, then when they want work dont on there classics etc they think that the skills possessd by another trade are worth less than they are..

I gave up doing any work for folk as they seem to think that bashing metal is for monkeys and hence they should pay peanuts .. peculiar situation since most of these folk couldn't put a nut in a monkeys mouth .. I would rather see them struggle with tere project than help these days. Its simply more lucrative to work on your own stuff rather than get involved wit the junk folk bring and expect to be resurrected for buttons .. It gets really easy to say "no" now.. and there is a certain degree of satisfaction in doing so.. The reluctance of folk who want there crap restored to pay a fair rate is the reason its so hard to find good skilled people .. employers just dont want to pay a fair rate .. Its a sad day when a fitter can earn more than a skilled craftsman .. which is why so many skilled craftsmen become fitters..
__________________
Ian
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 02-20-2018, 03:17 PM
AWM AWM is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Dora, Al
Posts: 41
Default

I have been following this thread in curiosity as I have worked in both the collision and hot rod/ resto industry. Now being an educator, salary expectations comes up regularly in meetings and discussions with students.
The salary info our state gives us is so far off I will not use it as an example for my students. High 30s to low 40s is not a very enticing number nor is it accurate for the shops I have worked at.
As others have stated, collision work is not resto/hot rod work. The easier money is in collision work.
So to answer the original question of what an employee may be worth is difficult. A commission based collision guy is worth as much as he/she can produce. A resto/street rod guy is worth the skills he can deliver and how the shop owner can sell those skills.

This is just a long way to say that I really do not know.
__________________
Anthony
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:13 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.