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Old 03-02-2020, 08:02 PM
berntd berntd is offline
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Default MIG butt-welding spot issues

Hello,

I have been grappling for years with these issue but suddenly thought I should ask here , just in case...

When welding sheet metal of ~42mils and under, I can just never get the MIG spots to work quite right.

I mean butt-welding 2 parts with spots.

They either have too high a buildup on the torch side or they do not penetrate fully through the metal. (edges still visible underneath)

I increase the voltage to get more heat. It helps with penetration but then the spots have little antennas / mountains on top because the wire seems to burn back when I stop the weld.


Longer welding time penetrates better but again has similar high buildup on top.

It never looks like in the pictures or videos and lots of grinding is usually required.

Is there anything else I should try to make them flatter but still penetrate?

I use 23 mils wire (0.6mm) with gas on a Lincoln MIG 180C welder.


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Bernt
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Old 03-03-2020, 05:09 AM
skintkarter skintkarter is offline
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Show us some pictures please Bernt and we can perhaps comment and help.
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  #3  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:55 AM
billfunk29 billfunk29 is offline
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Default Mig butt welds

If I want precision MIG spot welds, I cut the ball off every time. Slow, but more fun than grinding.
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Old 03-03-2020, 12:34 PM
John Buchtenkirch John Buchtenkirch is offline
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With minimal practice you can make plug welds on horizontal surfaces that look like factory spot welds and are actually more structurally sound than factory spot welds. Turn up the amps (on a 110 V welder all the way) and swing a quick circle in your drilled hole. Hint…… it’s actually more of a robotic swing (because it happens so fast) on your part rather than you watching it burn in, that is why practice is needed on the gauges you will be using for your project. Second hint……. anytime the wire burns back into your tip your feed is too slow or erratic or both. This method doesn’t work well on vertical surfaces, the weld puddle will droop off to the lower side . ~ John Buchtenkirch
!1pw1.JPG

!1pw2.JPG
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Last edited by John Buchtenkirch; 03-03-2020 at 04:45 PM.
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Old 03-03-2020, 03:50 PM
berntd berntd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Buchtenkirch View Post
With minimal practice you can make plug welds on horizontal surfaces that look like factory spot welds and are actually more structurally sound than factory spot welds. Turn up the amps (on a 110 V welder all the way) and swing a quick circle in your drilled hole. Hint…… it’s actually more of a robotic swing (because it happens so fast) on your part than you watching it burn in, that is why practice is needed on the gauges you will be using for your project. Second hint……. anytime the wire burns back into your tip your feed is too slow or erratic or both. This method doesn’t work well on vertical surfaces, the weld puddle will droop off to the lower side . ~ John Buchtenkirch
Attachment 55300

Attachment 55301
John, I am not plugwelding and not making spot welds.
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Old 03-03-2020, 04:43 PM
John Buchtenkirch John Buchtenkirch is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by berntd View Post
John, I am not plugwelding and not making spot welds.
Sorry about that, I saw the word spot in the heading and it threw me off. I will try to read more carefully in the future. John Buchtenkirch
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Old 03-03-2020, 04:46 PM
berntd berntd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Buchtenkirch View Post
Sorry about that, I saw the word spot in the heading and it threw me off. I will try to read more carefully in the future. John Buchtenkirch
Still great advise. Greatly appreciated!
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Old 03-03-2020, 08:14 PM
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Steve Hamilton Steve Hamilton is offline
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Hi Brent
I believe that part of Johns advice would help you with your butt weld question. He stated to crank up the heat which I agree will help your penetration. For butt welding I would say for a 110 welder try about 3/4 of max output. You will need good fit up, and lots of practice to get the wire feed rate and trigger time dialed in. I use .023 filler. Shielding gas also has an effect on penetration.co 2 will get good penetration but does cause more spatter. Argon co2 mix, 75/25 gives a softer arc with less spatter. The peak is usually a bubble that is caused by contamination or lack of gas.
Clean the metal mechanically with a sanding process to remove coatings and oxidation. New sheet steel is coated with oil so will need to be washed. Lacquer thinner or acetone work well. DO NOT use brakcleen as it produces a deadly gas when welded.

The difference between a beginner and a good welder is a few thousand hours of practice!!
Get some scrap metal to practice with

Steve
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Old 03-03-2020, 10:18 PM
Marc Bourget Marc Bourget is offline
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Steve,


Welding with the Brakeclean produces Phosgene Gas


Nasty, Really Nasty Stuff!
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