What is "AllMetalShaping"?

[Stilettoman]

I joined this forum primarily so that I could view the many projects shown here and possibly learn some useful skills or ideas. Now that I have had time to do some reading here I find this statement:

"This board was started to provide a resource for folks who wanted to learn and share knowledge about SHEET METAL SHAPING and related SHEET METAL SHAPING TOPICS such as sheet metal shaping tools. Sheet Metal Shaping involves changing the surface area of sheet metal by primarily stretching and shrinking although cutting and welding is certainly a valid technique. This is not a forum about machining, auto mechanics, welding (other than welding sheet metal), fabrication, painting, press brakes,------"

I would make the following observations --

1. I have not yet found any posting about sheet metal forming on this forum that is not part of something that is being "fabricated", except possibly a repair.

2. A press brake is one of several types of breaks that can be used to do two dimensional shaping of flat metal, i.e., not involving compound curves. If this is not metal shaping, what is it? Is it intended here to interpret that "bending" is not "shaping"?

3. If I run a flat sheet through a set of rollers that are not parallel, I can form a conical shape. This does not involve stretching or shrinking. Is this not sheet metal shaping?

4. I often have formed pieces on a break or with rollers to get a preliminary shape, then used shrinking, stretching or hammer forming to get the final shape---bending followed by three dimensional shaping. Isn't this common practice?

I am not trying to stir controversy or start an argument here. I just want some clarification before I post images and text about my custom car, motorcycle and airplane "fabrication" projects that might be considered inappropriate here.

My best skill is probably my ability to visualize that cutting and trimming and welding this piece from this car, mixing bowl or other object with minimal reshaping will give me the appearance I want. As a pilot, I am reminded of the definition of a "Superior Pilot" as one who uses his superior judgement to avoid situations requiring the use of his superior skills. I am trying to avoid the use of skills that I don't have!

[flebus]

"Sheet Metal Shaping involves changing the surface area of sheet metal by primarily stretching and shrinking although cutting and welding is certainly a valid technique. This is not a forum about machining, auto mechanics, welding (other than welding sheet metal), fabrication, painting, press brakes,------"

I agree, some of the prose could be better, and sometimes there's more discussion of fabrication and tool making than of actual shaping. And by sometimes, I mean often. That said, when the good stuff gets posted it is really, really good.

"Is it intended here to interpret that "bending" is not "shaping"?"

Yes, it is. The introductory paragraph covered this right up until it appeared to contradict it, but there you go. Fay Butler's glossary defines shape as "The aspect of a compound curve where the thickness of the panel is changed (shrinking and stretching)" which seems to be as good a definition as any.

[Resto Rod Race]

Hi Ben, my understanding of all this is to keep the topics closely related to shaping and the tools used to do so. Feel free to post away, if it gets way off topic the admins will politely let you know.
If you have custom car bike and plane projects im sure we would all be interested to see what you have, and how you did it or how you intend to do so. There is some increadible information and experience on this site for people of all levels.
Cheers

[MP&C]

Shaping: any process of shrinking or stretching sheet metal such that a change in the surface area of the sheet metal will result in an inverse change in the thickness. (hence mass does not change).

[Kerry Pinkerton]

Years back when AllMetalShaping.com was created as an alternative to MetalMeet, it was because MetalMeet had become basically a chat forum. You could talk about stick welding oil pipe, designing press brake dies, painting, machining, your Aunt Fannies varicose veins, or about anything else. When the admins tried to reign things in, they got dinged by the membership and some of the other moderators/admins. Threads got WAY off topic very frequently.

Johnny Ariel (our founder) and the rest of the admins, wanted a site that FOCUSED on ALL METAL SHAPING (hence the name).

We realize that frequently a sheet metal shaping project (stretching, shrinking, and smoothing) involves bending, welding, and fabrication including materials thicker than sheet metal. But we don't want to focus on it.

Obviously, if you are building a metal shaping tool, you're going to be doing something besides sheet metal, like welding, cutting, etc. Adam nailed it when he wrote:

Originally Posted by Resto Rod Race

...my understanding of all this is to keep the topics closely related to shaping and the tools used to do so. Feel free to post away, if it gets way off topic the admins will politely let you know...

There is a great thread going on right now by Marcus (GoJeep). At the moment we are seeing the design and build of his chassis. No sheet metal work at all but there will be and, because this is an end-to-end project and the chassis work is obviously part of it, it is desirable to see that work also. If the thread was going to only be about chassis design and fabrication we would not allow it. My roadster project falls in the same category because it is an end-to-end project.

If someone wants to show how they machine a part for his shaping tools, (anvils, eccentricts etc), that's fine but if they want to talk about restoring their lathe, that isn't. If they want to show welding techniques or questions about sheet metal, that's fine but if they want to get into welding bridges or farm equipment.....

It's kind of hard to provide a list of acceptable topics, there are a lot of gray areas and we try not to be hard asses. If you have a question about a topic, PM one of the admins.

[Marc Bourget]

I thought the purpose of this forum is to provide a resource to help you develop skills you don't have, not avoid them.

As for go jeep, isn't a "good foundation" a great basis for achieving (working from?) superior bodywork?

mjb

[David Gardiner]

I see that the criteria for being given the metalshaper of the month award has changed Kerry. You have always stated that in order to be given this the thread has to contain step by step photos showing every stage of the process but that has obviously changed.

David

[the_idaho_pirate]

I have learned so much from this site. If there is a subject not to my interest, I head in another direction. If something catches my eye, I try to learn more. I say thank you to everyone who has maintained this site, and thank you to everyone who has put up with my questions.

[idickers]

Originally Posted by the_idaho_pirate

I have learned so much from this site. If there is a subject not to my interest, I head in another direction. If something catches my eye, I try to learn more. I say thank you to everyone who has maintained this site, and thank you to everyone who has put up with my questions.

+1 If a topic is not of interest, I don't read it. But I end up reading a lot...

[Kerry Pinkerton]

Originally Posted by Marc Bourget

I thought the purpose of this forum is to provide a resource to help you develop skills you don't have, not avoid them.

As for go jeep, isn't a "good foundation" a great basis for achieving (working from?) superior bodywork?

mjb

Absolutely it is which is why we allow it. BUT if it was a thread that was only about the chassis without the major sheet metal shaping to come, we would not allow it. There are other sites that focus on chassis building etc.

If we allowed AllMetalShaping to become 'wide open', within short order you would have only 1 metal shaping post out of 10 and all our serious shapers would quit posting. We saw this happen elsewhere and are not going to allow it here. After all the original owners/admins die off who knows.

Originally Posted by David Gardiner

I see that the criteria for being given the metalshaper of the month award has changed Kerry. You have always stated that in order to be given this the thread has to contain step by step photos showing every stage of the process but that has obviously changed.

Obviously it has David.

In the 'How to become a MetalShaper of the Month' thread we stated

The requirement is that the person selected shows some, preferably a lot, of in process photos

It is our preference to have step-by-step photos but sometimes we don't have current threads with exactly what we would like. We try and choose folks who have done some really good work and also consider their skill level. We want the MSOTM to encourage folks at all skill levels. Btw, I changed that language from "requirement" to "preference" just to be more accurate.