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-   -   Scratch built car hauler...design study (https://allmetalshaping.com/showthread.php?t=2226)

Kerry Pinkerton 12-09-2010 11:37 PM

Scratch built car hauler...design study
 
9 Attachment(s)
I have this problem. Well, actually, I have lots of problems but most don't apply to this site.:lol:

One of my problems is that my brain never shuts off...not that it's necessarily doing anything significant or that it's even capable of doing anything significant. It's just always noodling about something or the other and working through what it would take to do......whatever. My long suffering wife (40 years next month) can spot it...."What are you building now...."

Someday, I'll finish the roadster....someday...surely someday....:eek:

And then what? I'd really like to build the Bugatti pedal car but that won't take long....surely....:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

What's been rolling around in the empty spaces for the past year or so is that I'd like to build a really, REALLY neat car hauler. Something that I could drive places with the roadster in it and possibly use it as a motor home of sorts also. Or make a tractor and trailer combination. I don't know....so many options.

Some of you are probably wondering what the heck I'm rambling about and what this has to do with an all metal shaping site? Well, we've always maintained that it was OK to get into the mechanical aspects of a project as long as the overall project was documented and had a majority of the project was metal shaping...which this will be. My roadster build is similar. There is a lot of non-metalshaping in it but it's all related to the overall project. Hard to build a body without the chassis/drivetrain:eek:.....

What I'd like to do is get input from the group on this project. Design ideas, schemes, thoughts, etc. If we start getting to far off track, those who are interested can join me in a social group that I'll start to discuss mechanical aspects of the project.

Some of the things that get my blood pumping:

Attachment 7673

Attachment 7674

Attachment 7675

Can you see what I see with this White COE?

Attachment 7681

And then there is this:

Attachment 7676

I have parts of the is 55-57 (single headlight Chevy COE:

Attachment 7677

Attachment 7678

Attachment 7679

I also own a 76 Chevy Crew Cab Dually with a strong 454, rebuilt tranny, new everything and a crapped out body...it was my Dad's.

I also have access (freebie from a Brother-in-law) to a couple 56 Chevy PU Cabs and am confident I could build a stretched COE cab from them.

What to do...what to do???

I've also thought about getting a late 30's panel truck and converting it into something by building a body off the back that was large enough for the roadster to fit in it.

Issues and design goals:

1- Has to have the 'look'. I can't describe it but will know it when I see it... Art Deco look. Could be scratch built but probably using something for the cab portion would be infinitely easier. The car container part will be pretty simple with primarily simple rolls and tapers either glued or riveted to curved stringers. Have to have a flip up rear end to get the car in and out.

2- Could be a single vehicle or tractor and trailer. Advantages to both approaches...not the least of which is having a drivable vehicle after the trailer is dropped. Another BIG advantage is room in the shop. A motorhome sized vehicle is going to consume my shop and won't fit on the lift.

3- Front wheel drive power train is an interesting thing? I know that some motor homes were made from Olds Tornado and Caddy Eldorado FWD big blocks. Attachment 7685 The car only weighs 2200 lbs and the majority of the hauler will be aluminum so weight shouldn't be a big deal. Is there a way to use the front axle from a 4WD 1 ton and turn the motor around to only drive the front axle? Seems like it should work but I don't know. The axle would have to be flopped over so it'd rotate in the right direction...maybe....I don't know.

4- I'd like it to be low. Lower than 8 inch or so clearance from the bottom of the frame. It'd be nice to use the front wheel drive so I could use a couple dropped single wheel axles in the rear in order to keep the deck height low. Another advantage to the front wheel drive.

5- I'd like to have decent gas mileage and not have to deal with DOT numbers, weight stations, etc. I may be able to get around if it is an 'RV'. ?????

6- I'm retired and don't have unlimited funds.

7- I'd generally rather build than buy because the building process is what I enjoy.

8- To be determined

So, what do YOU think?

Butch Duke 12-10-2010 12:43 AM

Hi Kerry
I sure would like some of those drugs that you are on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:lol: Sounds interesting!!!!
Front wheel drive ramp trucks & cab overs have been around for quite a while now.It has been a popular conversion.
I also have pondered the same ?'s in the past. I just keep putting it on the shelf. I do think thow I would finish the first project first. thats what I keep telling myself.:dunce:
Butch

Kerry Pinkerton 12-10-2010 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Butch Duke (Post 23474)
...Front wheel drive ramp trucks & cab overs have been around for quite a while now....

Can you tell me some brands/makes Butch. I'm aware of the Izusu ect COE turbo diesels but thought most of those were RWD?

bobadame 12-10-2010 01:04 AM

This is kind of what I've been working on with my Flxible project, sort of. I originally bought it to pull the little race car around. I chose it over other rigs because of the fuel mileage, 12 mpg compared to 4 mpg we got from a GMC motorhome like the green one you have pictured. The GMC did have interesting suspension in the back though. It had single sided swing arms , 2 on each side in the back that were sprung with air bags between the tandem wheels. This provided a flat floor that would work well as a car hauler. Fun stuff.

Maybe a Olds Toronado transaxle with a Duramax diesel in place of the Olds 455.

Peter Miles 12-10-2010 01:58 AM

I'm a real fan of the White 3000 series trucks.

There are some interesting customs and design studies that were done for White such as in the following link:
http://blog.hemmings.com/index.php/2...thing-on-niko/

http://images.hemmings.com/wp-conten...05_resized.jpg

The Classic White Forum:
http://www.classicwhitetrucks.com/

The American Truck Historical Society:
http://www.aths.org/

Some early firetrucks are also interesting:
http://allmetalshaping.com/picture.p...pictureid=4369
from the following thread:
http://allmetalshaping.com/showthrea...ght=fire+truck

Dougg 12-10-2010 02:14 AM

I've collected a few of the toro suspensions and trans for that same reason.
Am I gonna do it? Doutfull, there are I think 27 (don't count'em anymore) projects ahead of that one

TheRodDoc 12-10-2010 02:23 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Here is a very high-tec hauler from the 30's. I realize it would be hard to duplicate but maybe you can get a couple ideas from it. < grin >

Do you think it made it to where ever it was going?

Attachment 7697

Dougg 12-10-2010 02:36 AM

Sure looks like Red Green in that pic:lol:

Overkill 12-10-2010 02:44 AM

Power and mileage
 
Kits to put the Cummins 6bt (Dodge Cummins) in front of many different transmissions are available. With the 12 valve version, you get mechanical pump, not electronic. Motors and parts are plentiful and far cheaper than Duramax or Ford. Both power and mileage.

Going for a lighter vehicle? Check into the Cummins 4bt (there's a forum on it), basically a 4 cylinder of the 6bt. Many came in NPR trucks (Frito Lay trucks) with some in front of TH400 GM automatics.

The downfall of the early GM front wheel drive units is no overdrive.

Downfall of the Cummins motor is that they are HEAVY - the 4bt is 770#, and tall. Further, you need to look into the overall length when using the 6bt. And you have to listen to a rattling diesel....

That being said, I'd vote for motorhome and trailer configuration. I know here in California you can skip the scales, haul more weight if it's an RV, etc. Trailers have much lower insurance rate and registration cost.

As you're into art deco, consider Art Himsl's motorhome for a styling cue http://arthimsl.com/zeppelin.htm

Some early RV trailers had similar design features, and might make for an interesting car hauler. I'd suggest windows in it to show off the roadster, and have it open like a beetles (the insect) wings.

John

oldtin 12-10-2010 07:43 AM

Keep in mind the weight bias if considering front wheel drive. Most people don't know or don't recall that there was a cargo version of the GMC style motorhome......they didn't work, once loaded the front drive wouldn't pull the loads. The regular motorhomes often had to be pushed up the ramp leading from the factory to the holding area, the incline would unload the front end enough to cause traction issues.:lol:

If your serious about front wheel drive I would consider a 3/4 or 1ton 4x4 drivetrain, later models are independant suspension, most have O/D available as well as a variety of manual and auto trans frome 4 to 6 or more gears, can be lowered and are every bit as beefy as the eldo, toro driveline. Plus you could use the rear drive output as a PTO for a winch, generator, compressor or hydraulic system. A simple in/out coupler on the rear drive allows four wheel selection to be used as front wheel drive only and freeing up the 2wd selection of the case to be used as a PTO.
The truck drivetrains allow a larger selection of engines and transmissions. There are even lowered spindles availabe for some of the IRS front ends, but most of the newer 4x4s aren't much higher than the 2wd versions.


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